📜 AISW #036: Anonymous8, USA-based automotive business / presales leader (AI, Software, & Wetware interview)
An interview with an anonymous USA-based leader in automotive business development and presales, on their stories of using AI and how they feel about AI using people's data and content
Introduction - Anonymous8
This post is part of our 6P interview series on “AI, Software, and Wetware”. Our guests share their experiences with using AI, and how they feel about AI using their data and content.
Note: In this article series, “AI” means artificial intelligence and spans classical statistical methods, data analytics, machine learning, generative AI, and other non-generative AI. See this Glossary and “AI Fundamentals #01: What is Artificial Intelligence?” for reference.
🗣️ Quick note for those who prefer listening to reading: Substack now supports read-aloud natively in the Substack app. If you try it on this post, let me know what you think!
Interview - Anonymous8
Today I welcome my 8th anonymous guest, from the USA, to “AI, Software, and Wetware”. Thank you for making time for doing this interview with me! Please tell us all about yourself and who you are and what you do.
Fantastic. Karen, thank you so much for, number 1, just inviting me to be part of this platform and share some of my thoughts, insights, and opinions about this type of technology and how it's transforming many different industries, but also how it's supporting or enabling other types of technology to reach its full potential. So, thank you for that.
My professional journey consists of diverse roles, predominantly focusing on business strategy and planning. I have been fortunate to work at three global OEMs [Original Equipment Manufacturers] and two Tier 1s [major suppliers to OEMs]. My responsibilities varied from strategic planning, strategic alliances, product marketing, product planning, and engineering - fuel economy optimization, software development to testing and validating the crashworthiness of vehicles.
In the early stages of my career, I was directly involved in engineering work, specializing in electronics and software development. Taking control models and turning them into code and establishing the feature test cases to ensure the robustness and readiness of the vehicle to withstand adverse road conditions, such as ice or snow.
I subsequently joined a software solutions company, where I focused on establishing strategic partnerships and solution development, driving value creation for our customers. My career has come full circle as I transitioned into business development and sales.
It's definitely an active and interesting cycle that we're in right now, with all the movements around different types of AI and machine learning. Can you tell us about your level of experience with AI and machine learning and analytics, and how you've used it professionally or personally, or if you've ever studied the technology?
I may no longer be directly involved in engineering, but indirectly, I'm very much immersed in it through the products I sell. At my last two companies, we've been leveraging AI components to enhance user experiences. In the automotive industry, consumers now expect smartphone-like responses, with the ability to download new apps or services instantly, or to receive frequent technology updates. This necessitates a level of "smartness" to deliver personalized experiences.
We're using AI to not only collect data, but also to ask the right questions and derive insights that drive meaningful actions and enhance the user experience. Vehicles are no longer static devices, but dynamic, living machines that can be upgraded, updated, and modified based on user needs and preferences.
Professionally, it's fascinating to witness the evolution of technology and its capabilities. On a personal level, one of my career goals is to serve on a board. In preparing for this, I've been using AI tools to refine my bios and resumes, asking questions like, "Is there a more effective way to present my experiences?" Sometimes, the AI output isn't quite right, but with different queries, I can mix and match to craft my message.
You’re using the AI tools with your wetware, not instead of it. 🙂
I've heard people speak in a fear-like manner about AI and how it's going to basically take over and take jobs and blah blah blah. And I'm like, AI is at this state where it's still in its infancy. Though it's proliferating in popularity, it still can't stand on its own. It's not like it's going to take over today, and it's not going to take over in 10 years. But what I see it as right now is an augmentation to human capability. And because I see it as an augmentation to the human capability, that means we still have to apply some of our intellect to identify and decipher, “Okay, this is what it spit out, but how do I make this coherent in a way that can convey the message and the depth that I want it to?”
So that's kind of how I've used AI professionally and personally.
Okay, thanks!
Oh, and you asked, have I taken any classes? I haven't taken any classes, but one thing I definitely want to do is an AI course for business applications. I would like to understand “How can I, today, better leverage some of the tooling that's out there?” Because it's already available, though like I said, it's in its infancy. But there's still quite a bit of opportunity where I could, in small pilots, test things out just to see what it comes up with.
I interviewed somebody last week who’s working in the area of AI marketing ethics (). And he's developing a course for people to learn how to use AI ethically to support them in their marketing activities. There's probably a course out there for what you're looking for.
I'm curious to know: in your business development and presales role, obviously there's a lot of communication. Have you used, or resisted using, tools like ChatGPT to help you with authoring those communications? Or are you really only using it for your board member materials?
I primarily use AI tools for personal purposes, as my customer interactions typically revolve around our products and internal content, where I don't currently require AI assistance. However, I am open to exploring AI tools for professional use in the future.
Currently, my professional use of AI is mainly through smart features in Outlook that correct grammar and punctuation. While these features have been helpful, I haven't yet plunged into more extensive AI usage for full-blown communications.
You probably spend a lot of your time in meetings.
Yes!
Zoom and Teams have different AI-based features. They have automatic captioning, and they have meeting summarization and features like that. Do you use any of those features on a day-to-day basis?
While I haven't yet implemented this approach, I'm open to considering its potential applications. Although I haven't yet explored extensive AI usage in my professional communications, it's not outside the realm of possibility. For instance, AI-powered transcription of recorded customer or partner meetings could prove beneficial in capturing important details for future review or reference.
I'm always curious, when people talk about meeting summarizations and communications, about confidentiality. Especially if you're talking with partners or customers, confidentiality can be a big concern in using those tools. And allowing the tools to record and transcribe and summarize can be a risk. Whatever confidential information you may be discussing, using the tool could expose that info to the people who make the tool. And from there, the info can bleed out into the wild, right? So some people that I've talked to have actually hesitated to use those tools - not because they don't like the tools, but because customer or client confidentiality, or even doctor-patient confidentiality in health care applications, becomes a factor.
Indeed, my hesitancy in adopting AI extensively in business stems from concerns about clarity on acceptable boundaries. With the technology evolving rapidly, it's crucial to understand where the lines are drawn to avoid potential risks such as leaks that could lead to competitive disadvantages or detriment to the business, partners, or customers. Given the fluidity of the situation, it's challenging to know precisely where these boundaries lie. It feels like we're building the vehicle while simultaneously driving it, which makes it difficult to confidently navigate the landscape.
Right. One of the analogies I've been using with folks is that they worry about “AI is so complicated, and I don't understand it. I don't know how to build a machine learning model.” But you shouldn't have to know how to be a mechanic in order to drive a car safely. We just want people to learn how to ‘drive’ AI safely and securely and not have to worry about their information being compromised or something leaking out. So they don't have to know how to build a model.
But we do want to encourage and support people in learning how to ask good questions about, “Well, okay, if I use this tool, what data are you going to save and where is it going to go and who's going to have access to it and how can I control it and see what you're doing?” Learning to ask those good questions is sort of an AI literacy or data literacy aspect that I think is important.
Absolutely. I completely agree.
You mentioned one specific story about using an AI tool, ChatGPT or Copilot or something like that, to help you with your board materials, your bio, and your resume.
Exactly.
I’m curious about any other specific examples you’ve seen. Maybe one of the features that your teams are developing, where they've tried using AI to make something smarter? For instance, being smarter about software updates or some specific feature. Usually it takes some iterations to get AI models right - some things work quickly, some things need refinements, and biases often need attention. Do you have any stories about times where you've tried either building features, or using features in somebody else's tool, where it didn't work well and you had to adapt to that?
Just similar to what I was sharing about the fact that certain sentence structure or something, sometimes it didn't convey the meaning that I was trying to get across. And so that's where human intelligence comes in. Like, this isn't exactly what I was aiming for. And then you have to read, just like you would do if you were training a model, you have to ask it more questions to get to where you're trying to go.
In terms of a specific example where something didn't go as planned, I would say maybe Insta Headshots. It's an AI-generated photo shop, if you will. And it will take your picture in these natural scenes. And sometimes it looks pretty accurate - like, it's pretty good. It'll color your suit in different colors. Have you heard of it?
No, I need to look that up. (instaheadshots.com)
Sometimes you just gotta play with these things, right? Because they're not going to get it right. But it's kind of cool that such a thing exists, right? Where you can take a picture and it's a natural picture and you're like, wow.
I saw a post recently on Bluesky or LinkedIn where someone had posted about having computer-generated headshots and a headshot taken by a professional photographer. And could people tell which one was which, which one did they like? It's interesting to see the style.
Image generators are one of the AI tools that people talk a lot about. And some people have tried the music generation tools. But one of the big concerns there, and this is kind of coming up as a general theme, especially with the generative AI tools, is: Where did they get the data and the content that they use to train their tools on?
Exactly.
Sometimes they take data that users put in online systems or they published online. And companies don't always say what they're going to do with our data when we sign up for it. Some are taking copyrighted content or content that, yeah, it's publicly available, but that doesn't mean it's free to use for commercial purposes. So there's a lot of concern around that not being ethical.
Indeed, public skepticism surrounding AI tools and their handling of data is a major concern. Ensuring data privacy and creating trust between businesses and consumers is vital. One way to achieve this is by focusing on transparency in privacy policies, granting users control over their data, and maintaining clarity in every interaction where consumer data might be involved.
The transparency should extend to businesses seeking permission to use consumer data for their purposes, creating a clear line of communication between the consumer and the company. This level of transparency is crucial in an age where smartphones and apps frequently request access to personal information, such as location or cookies.
My friend's startup aims to restore trust between businesses and consumers by emphasizing data privacy and transparency, which I find fascinating. The work they are doing is a crucial building block in addressing the concerns and building confidence in the responsible use of consumer data.
Well, there's consent, and then there's informed consent, where people actually understand what they're consenting to. You see a lot of these terms and conditions on websites and apps, and they're 10 or 20 pages long, and they're in legalese that even lawyers struggle to understand.
So the prompt might say, “We need to use your pictures to generate this head shot for you”. And you say “Yes”. You're allowing them to do that. But then maybe they're also taking those pictures and using them to train models that they're going to sell to somebody else. And you don't really want to consent to that, but that wasn't the question that you were asked.
Exactly. Yeah.
I really want to hear more about your friend's startup. I want to look into that.
It's called “360 of me”. Actually, I'll send you a link. (360ofme.com) I would love to introduce you to Kara Grasso. She is absolutely phenomenal.
I would love to meet her and talk with her about the whole idea of how to rebuild the trust between people and the AI and tech companies. We're seeing a lot of data out there now that trust has been diminishing recently. Because people are starting to realize, “You're doing what with my data?” Or “You're capturing this or you're using pictures of me or my family for what purposes?”
And there was that big uproar over the summer about Meta and what they're doing with people's content, and Suno stealing all the YouTube videos. Trust has been severely damaged in the whole global ecosystem, I think. Someone who's actually looking at what companies need to do to rebuild that, I would love to see what they're doing and what her thoughts are.
Oh, yes. I'll definitely introduce you. She has lots of thoughts. And, actually, Kara is the Chief Revenue Officer, but the CEO of this company, Cindy Warner, oh my goodness. This woman is a powerhouse, just incredibly brilliant. I'll send you some videos, and actually you could probably just YouTube her. You'll find the videos.
She is on a mission to restore trust, in terms of consumers being clear on how their data is being used. And not only how their data is being used, but also, she wants to restore the ability for the consumer as a contributor of the data to get a piece of the pie in terms of money, right? And so she's also on that campaign too. And I was like, you know, you're absolutely right. It's the user's data that's being used to train these models. Why shouldn't they get a cut of whatever revenue you're generating?
Yeah. In the big picture, what I've been hearing people call it this year is “the 3 C's” for creative rights or contributors rights, and it's for Consent and Credit and Compensation. In other words, if someone uses content from a book that you wrote, and they cite it, you should be credited for it.
Exactly. It's like royalties. It's royalties in music. If you're going to use my stuff, then I should get a cut.
Yes. Exactly. Looking for the 3 C's. Some people say 4 C's, with Control as the 4th C. But Control is really, I think, part of Consent.
Yes. I agree that you can use it, and I get to say how you can use it.
Yes. That's it. So 360ofMe sounds like a neat company; thank you for sharing that. It's really cool.
Oh, absolutely. Yeah.
We talked about consent, and you mentioned transparency. Do you know of any companies that have been transparent in a good way about the data for tools that you've used? Or more generally, do you feel like companies have been transparent about where they got their data and what they've done with it?
Despite the existence of privacy documents and terms and conditions, the tools I have used still lack complete clarity regarding data usage. These documents, often spanning multiple pages, fail to provide comprehensive information on how my data might be employed, potentially requiring legal consultation to fully understand.
This lack of transparency persists even when using platforms or tools that claim data isolation or containment within an account. While it may be stated that the data will be used for the company's purposes, the specifics of how and what data will be utilized remain unclear, leaving users uncertain about the potential implications.
You mentioned the features for making cars smarter. With automotive, there's been a lot of discussion about the privacy (or lack thereof) for data, for people's data that their cars are gathering. Cars have so many sensors. And now they have interior sensing cameras, so you've got images of people too.
There's some legal protection for privacy for content on our phones. But if you connect that phone to your car's infotainment system, suddenly, they can get data and content out of our infotainment systems without a warrant. There are really powerful things that we can do with the data from the car, but it also creates some serious privacy risks. So there are some tradeoffs there that we need to look at, and I'm really curious to hear your thoughts on this.
Let me reframe your question. You want to hear my thoughts on how we deliver these advanced features that people want for their cars and still protect their privacy? With the data that's being collected from them while they're in and around their cars?
Yes.
I think this is part of what 360ofMe and the platform that they've built out, right, is -assessing and understanding that. Because once you buy the car, it's yours effectively, but at the same time it has this feedback loop back to, let's call it the mother ship, so that way it can continue to be this dynamic machine throughout the life of that vehicle.
To establish transparency, it is crucial for users to be aware upfront of the ongoing data collection from various sensors and services within the vehicle. This data is gathered by the OEM, but to enhance the vehicle's functionality and improve the user experience over time. By clearly communicating the purpose and benefits of data collection, users can feel more confident that their information is being used responsibly and to their advantage.
Some of the concerns come in with features like, for instance, some of the OnStar systems. They're always keeping track of where somebody is. And that's a potential privacy concern. Then there's information about how somebody drives, and the different insurance companies. You mentioned partnerships and strategy. It's a whole ecosystem, right? Where the OEMs have data from the car that could be used for purposes that maybe the person didn't intend or want.
Yes. Exactly. And this is the beauty of a company likes 360ofMe. They will facilitate, let's call it, that transaction to make sure it's clear to the user, the end user of that product, and also, to the business customer, making sure they have all the necessary rights and privileges to obtain, process, and utilize that data.
Yeah. We could probably talk for a long time about this! It’s such an interesting area, and I'd love to hear more sometime about these kinds of features. Do you have an example of a smart feature that you're trying to build? And where would the data come from for that?
I mean, we don't even have to think about the future. We could think about even in the past, like Elon Musk, right? When they developed the Tesla, I think it was 2008-2009, he set up a subscription service where you could enhance your range, based on your driving behavior. And so, based on your driving behavior that got set up, then you could identify if you needed to subscribe for more range. And then they would do a software update based on you subscribing. But at least you had a way to gauge if you were overextending yourself and needed more range.
Okay, that's a good example of how a smart feature could be utilized.
In the future, infotainment systems in vehicles will become more dynamic, allowing users to add and download various apps and services for convenience, as well as safety features as new regulations come into effect. This will be facilitated by connectivity and software updates, which are crucial enabling technologies for software defined vehicles.
Just like with smartphones, users will be able to access a vehicle app to select and download features as their needs change over time, even if they didn't purchase them initially. This could include app enhancements, service enhancements, or functionality enhancements, depending on the user's requirements. This dynamic nature of infotainment systems will allow vehicles to adapt to changing regulations, powertrain requirements, and user preferences, providing a more personalized and convenient driving experience.
Yeah. There's obviously a lot of potential for doing some really neat things. We have one car, and it's an older car and it doesn't have a lot of smart features. But the way that I drive is not the same as the way that my husband drives, you know, as far as accelerating and decelerating.
And that's the cool thing about personalization, right? It can be driver dependent. And I think it's going to come to a point to the very thing you're saying, right? You have a shared vehicle, but you'll be able to set the parameters based on who's driving in the vehicle.
This is where I wonder about tradeoffs in automation and human control. I might have to, or want to, manually go into the infotainment system and say, “Hey, it's me”, versus it recognizing, say, from the weight of the person in the driver's seat and concluding, “oh, this is Karen driving, this is not her husband driving”. Our scale at home does this — my app tries to figure out which profile a new weight reading probably belongs to — but it lets me override that assumption before the data is saved.
Machines can judge a lot from sensors and make inferences, but they’re not always going to be accurate. It's nice to have it automated, but it's also nice to make sure it's right and to have control over it, you know?
There’s the privacy aspect. Should the car company be able to sell the data about what they think is my weight, or interior pictures from the car, to a data broker, or to an AI company for training a model, without my consent?
And what do you do when you get a new driver? It’s a “cold start” for the AI system - it doesn’t know anything about them. For instance, you've got a teenager that just reached driving age, and they're trying to learn. So it'd be nice to maybe configure larger braking margins for new drivers, you know?
Exactly. The concept of multiple seat memory settings, currently available in many vehicles, can be expanded to encompass the entire vehicle, creating a more personalized and convenient experience for each user. Just as users can currently save seat preferences for different drivers, such as themselves, their spouse, or other family members, this same level of customization could extend to various aspects of the vehicle.
With this expanded personalization, each user could have their own saved preferences for things like infotainment settings, climate control, and even safety features. When a user enters the vehicle, they could simply select their profile, and the vehicle would automatically adjust to their pre-defined settings, providing a seamless and tailored driving experience.
Okay. That's a neat vision.
I’m wondering too whether your personal data or content has been used by an AI-based system. You fly a lot, so you're probably going through the TSA and their biometrics and photo screenings. They're using machine learning now to compare your ID to your face, things like that.
So there are probably a lot of ways that machine learning is having an effect on your life. I'm curious if you have any thoughts about any of those travel security features. Or about LinkedIn, and how they're using our content that we put into LinkedIn?
Yes. But I have to admit, one of the things that I've been campaigning for is getting an enterprise LinkedIn account globally. Because LinkedIn is doing some really cool things with AI level technology and really enhancing the experience. Especially on the Sales Navigator side where you can pull in more, I would say, IQ on the account and lead generation. And it can really help you to decipher, what makes your potential lead tick? Where does their interest lie?
And so for me, when you sign up for LinkedIn, with all the data privacy, people don't always realize that their information might be used through LinkedIn. But I think there's a lot to be said about how we can facilitate business, right?
And instead of being afraid of it, I think we just need to figure out, how do we create more transparency and more clarity between the consumer of the data and the one who's contributing the data? So that there's that clear line of understanding of what's being pulled and used in different ways in places. So that way, there's not that mistrust, like, “I don't know what you're going to do with this”.
And for me, in sales and business development, the things I see LinkedIn doing, the lead finder and getting more details around that lead, and what may be a trigger for them, is super important for me in sales, because I'm always trying to close business. If LinkedIn can share a couple of tidbits with me to help me get to a sale, I want to know what those tidbits are. Because I might not readily have the information, and that's the whole purpose of the platform, right? It's really a B-to-B platform, and it's to help me engage with an audience that I may not have otherwise had access to. And so they have unique insights because these people have been interacting on this platform. And that they can share with me to better position myself with that lead or that account. And so for me, I think things like this are invaluable, actually. And I think this is how we really reimagine business going forward into the future.
I don't have any experience with LinkedIn Sales Navigator. I used recruiting features while I was Director of AI at Wind River, because we were actively hiring. So I know LinkedIn Recruiter has some features there. Some were useful, and some weren’t.
I've also seen a recent study about how over 50% of the content on LinkedIn was at least partially AI-generated. So there's some concern about the quality of the content disintegrating, you know?
Another thing that comes up with LinkedIn is there's been some discussion about ageism and how they had some very ageist ads. And it took about 4 months of people protesting to get LinkedIn to take them down. But LinkedIn knows so much about us. I mean, they know what year our degrees were, or our employment history going back. Most people have profile pictures. They can see our network and our DMs. They know a lot about us.
And, again, it's one thing if we opt in and we consent and we say, “Yes, you can use this to help me find colleagues from companies I used to work at”. But if that data also is being sold off to a broker or used for other purposes, then that’s concerning.
So it's interesting to see all the different aspects where AI is impacting our lives. I think LinkedIn has over a billion users, so it certainly has an effect on a lot of people.
That is interesting. That's really interesting, Karen.
It's funny. Some people can tell when AI has been used. I can tell in some cases. I'll read something and know, okay, that person did NOT write that. It’s not their style at all. But as far as using a tool like ChatGPT to help write content, I empathize with people who are not native English speakers who are using these tools to help them polish new content based on their original ideas. I totally understand that.
But sometimes AI-generated content just comes out very bland-sounding, and it doesn't feel original. And often it looks like, okay, someone took a post, and they fed it into a genAI tool and said, “write me a reply comment”, and then they paste it in. And that just doesn't add any value. I can usually tell when someone did that. I read it and go, okay, it’s a waste of time. It lacks original thought, and that is disappointing. If it happens too much, I unfollow or even block.
I agree. That's bizarre. Yeah.
I mean, there's certainly a lot of potential where LinkedIn could do some good things with it. I think that would make it more valuable for us, and it's interesting that you have these insights about the Sales Navigator because I've never seen that. So, good to know that there's some potential opportunities there, especially from a business perspective.
Sales Navigator offers a lot of benefits, particularly in discovering mutual connections between yourself and a potential contact. This tool allows you to identify individuals within your network who are connected to the person you're trying to reach, providing an opportunity to request an introduction through a shared acquaintance. Leveraging existing relationships to establish new ones can be an effective strategy in business development and sales, as it helps expand your network and explore more possibilities. In a competitive business environment, it is essential to exhaust all possible avenues and not overlook any potential opportunities.
And you also obviously want to help your customer solve the real problem that they care about the most.
Yes. Yes.
And that's why those insights are so crucial, right? Like, what challenges are they trying to solve? What pain do they have? What have they been communicating?
When dealing with strategic accounts, particularly publicly-traded companies, it can be beneficial to have tools that can quickly analyze financial documents such as annual reports and 10K filings. This analysis can help identify the company's strategic vision and objectives, as well as understand the information they are sharing with their stakeholders. By gaining a deeper insight into the company's goals and priorities, you can better position your products and services to meet their needs and address their concerns. Accessing and utilizing such tools can significantly improve your ability to target potential customers.
Yeah, the summarization capabilities of AI, I think, are one of the more useful tools. The only danger is that sometimes they end up hallucinating or making up things that actually weren't in the documents. That's a risk. I think the tools have gotten better, and there are ways now to tell it to only use text from primary sources. But you wouldn't want to rely on it and have it actually not be right.
Yes.
I really appreciate you sharing these perspectives, because I don't come from that same business orientation that you do, and you've got the technical background as well. So your insights are really valuable. Is there anything else that you would like to share with our audience today for this interview?
Not at this moment!
Well, thank you for the time - I enjoyed our conversation!
Thank you. Thank you for this opportunity. That's awesome.
Interview References and Links
www.360ofme.com (company page on LinkedIn)
About this interview series and newsletter
This post is the last 2024 entry in our interview series on “AI, Software, and Wetware”. It showcases how real people around the world are using their wetware (brains and human intelligence) with AI-based software tools or being affected by AI.
And we’re all being affected by AI nowadays in our daily lives, perhaps more than we realize. For some examples, see post “But I don’t use AI”:
We want to hear from a diverse pool of people worldwide in a variety of roles. If you’re interested in being a featured interview guest (anonymous or with credit), please get in touch!
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Series Credits and References
Microphone photo by Michal Czyz on Unsplash (contact Michal Czyz on LinkedIn)
